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Who told these women they were Rubenesque?
Has that word now become just another way of saying BBW?
That isn't "rubenesque" dammit.

Grar... okay .. so just STRIKE FROM YOUR MIND me saying something about me being exactly rubenesque.

I'm like... 1/4 the size of those women.
Guh

Comments

( 23 comments — Leave a comment )
punkalicia
Jan. 30th, 2002 01:04 pm (UTC)
you are really obsessed with big girls.

and i'd like to say, it's not that thier fat, it's that most of them are kinda ugly and have aweful haircuts. and harsh light is no ones friend.
blackmanxy
Jan. 30th, 2002 01:17 pm (UTC)
Big girls rule, yo.

Though, uh... yeah, I pretty much agree with your assessment.
maddening
Jan. 30th, 2002 02:49 pm (UTC)
The photos are *very* bad.
The makeup, the hair, and the clothing... all of it combines for badness.
My point was that all over the internet that's the body type that's being called "rubenesque" ... and that's just sooooooo not rubenesque.

I seem to be obsessed with the big women, but it's just becuase I keep trying to find pictoral representations of something comparable to me and there's ... nothing.
Either the extreme thin scale or the extreme large scale.
mjfgates
Jan. 30th, 2002 02:18 pm (UTC)
Bleah. Just.... bleah. I understand the whole "accept your body" kind of thing, but... those women really need to go on a fucking diet.
blackmanxy
Jan. 30th, 2002 02:41 pm (UTC)
Heh
"Accept your body, but diet to appease my aesthetic sensibilities."

Or am I misinterpreting?
bightchee
Jan. 30th, 2002 04:11 pm (UTC)
Re: Heh
Wouldn't there then be a decision of whether to be considered a "healthy weight" or not?
I'm all for self confidence, but the other end of that is self delusion. You can talk and strut all you want on Jenny Jones' "I'm not too fat to dress the way I do" show: come back on the air with her when medical problems arise from your not doing something sensible and understanding how your body works and reacts to how you treat it.

Here I'm simply talking about the women pictured there. Are they going to say they would be less happy and less proud of the way they look if they lost weight? If they were offered a miracle diet that would put them in a healthier standing, would they reject it?
mjfgates
Jan. 30th, 2002 05:23 pm (UTC)
Re: Heh
Yep, you're misinterpreting. More like, "Diet to be able to walk a mile." "Diet to not croak of a heart attack at age forty." Stuff like that. I'm perfectly cognizant of the difference between "not as thin as Jennifer Aniston" and "morbidly obese."
subbes
Jan. 30th, 2002 02:26 pm (UTC)
I'd do http://www.bbwrr.com/LillianProfilePage.htm, unless she has an ugly accent.

Most of 'em are too big to be Reubenesque. I now wonder what people think of me when I say I like reubenesque women. Eek.
maddening
Jan. 30th, 2002 02:47 pm (UTC)
That's what I was shocked about.
That body type displayed there isn't rubenesque.
It isn't zaftig either... another word ruined.
Zaftig literally means "juicy" ...
In modern parlance... "thick" would be comparable.
thick and muscular, curvaceous, large rounded hips, rounded, shapely ass, all over covered with a layer of softness.

Marilyn Monroe during her thicker years... the model Emme...Anna Nicole Smith (minus the enormous kajungas)
subliminalis
Jan. 30th, 2002 06:38 pm (UTC)
ruben?
maddening
Jan. 30th, 2002 07:14 pm (UTC)
you're fucking kidding me... right?
subliminalis
Jan. 31st, 2002 11:14 am (UTC)
Re:
i wish i was...

who/what is ruben?
maddening
Jan. 31st, 2002 02:00 pm (UTC)
I was refering to Ruben... the classical painter.
Chad (azmatiq) was referring to Ruben... the sandwhich made with corned beef, saurkraut and thousand island dressing on toasted bread.

subliminalis
Jan. 31st, 2002 02:03 pm (UTC)
Re:
ah, the joke sets in deeper

now, rubenesque? why obese women? did ruben paint mostly overweight women?

josh
maddening
Jan. 31st, 2002 02:16 pm (UTC)
GAH! That's exactly the problem.
There is no "nice" way to say "overweight" or "Obese" to women who are overweight and obese have begun to use the word "rubenesque" to describe themselves.
It's a wrong use.
Look at any classical art, Josh. The women are not Kate Moss... but neither are they Camyrn Manheim. They're somewhere inbetween with larger bodies, voluptuous curves, large hips... they're actually WOMEN.
Ruben (or Michealangelo for that matter... ANY of the artists of the time) did not paint overweight or obese women he painted BEAUTIFUL women... the *ideal* of beauty for the time.
And it's what *most* women actually look like out here in reality.

I was looking for photos of rubenesque women and I got women who loooked like those above.. those are NOT rubenesque women.


Rubenesque (rb-nsk)
adj.
Of, relating to, or in the style of painting of Peter Paul Rubens.
Plump or fleshy and voluptuous. Used of a woman.

Not obese... FLESHY...
Just like Zaftig...

zaftig or zoftig (zftk, -tg)
adj.
Full-bosomed.
Having a full, shapely figure.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Yiddish zaftik, juicy, from Middle High German saftec, from saft, juice, from Old High German saf.]



*juicy**
Excellent word.

my major point was that the word has been misappropriated by a group that it does NOT describe.

subliminalis
Jan. 31st, 2002 02:19 pm (UTC)
Re:
ah, you learn something new every day.
azmatiq
Jan. 31st, 2002 01:19 am (UTC)
It's good, if you like Sauerkraut.
subliminalis
Jan. 31st, 2002 11:16 am (UTC)
Re:
YEY! i love it!

but what is it?
rakafkaven
Jan. 31st, 2002 08:09 am (UTC)
I may be putting myself at risk of sounding asinine and foolish (more than usual, even), but aren't you basically agreeing with absolutcalm's attitude here? That there is a level of obesity that is different from a health weight (body-mass index be damned), and that equivocation and defensiveness about that is silly? Things like the appropriation of the word "rubenesque". That word had a meaning once; a fairly specific one. I've dated Rubenesque women. I've also dated obese women. I loathed the attitude that it would be inappropriate to directly refer to the actual build of the larger girls, except through euphemisms. Like "Rubenesque". It didn't make them any less fat, it didn't even make them feel any less fat; it just made Rubenesque synonymous with fat. The word didn't change reality; reality changed the word. But heaven forfend admitting that a 240-lb, 5'7" woman is any different (aesthetically or health-wise) than a 190-lb, 5'7" woman who works out.

For the record, I don't know that I've ever brought up the matter of a SO's weight. Not because it's taboo, but just because I don't care unless they do. I want them to be healthy, and I want them to be happy with themselves. If I like them well enough to date them in the first place, I don't see why that would change unless my perception of them changes (e.g., putting on 40 lbs in 6 months; insisting on rich, expensive, snacky foods; and refusing to do so much as go for a walk might indicate issues beyond the weight that makes them less attractive. Not that this has ever happened with me... *cough*)
maddening
Jan. 31st, 2002 09:59 am (UTC)
I may be putting myself at risk of sounding asinine and foolish (more than usual, even), but aren't you basically agreeing with absolutcalm's attitude here? That there is a level of obesity that is different from a health weight (body-mass index be damned), and that equivocation and defensiveness about that is silly?

People who are anywhere from a little overweight (and have been for awhile) to hugely overweight are sensitive about that because of the enormous taboo.
Having been quite large at a point in my life, when someone says "fat people" it takes quite a bit of mental re-arranging to *not* lump myself in there.

I AGREE that there is a level of obesity where you have to just STOP and LOSE WEIGHT for your health.


Like "Rubenesque". It didn't make them any less fat, it didn't even make them feel any less fat; it just made Rubenesque synonymous with fat.

And that's not what the word means.
::shrug::





The word didn't change reality; reality changed the word. But heaven forfend admitting that a 240-lb, 5'7" woman is any different (aesthetically or health-wise) than a 190-lb, 5'7" woman who works out.

I don't get what you're saying here..



For the record, I don't know that I've ever brought up the matter of a SO's weight. Not because it's taboo, but just because I don't care unless they do. I want them to be healthy, and I want them to be happy with themselves. If I like them well enough to date them in the first place, I don't see why that would change unless my perception of them changes (e.g., putting on 40 lbs in 6 months; insisting on rich, expensive, snacky foods; and refusing to do so much as go for a walk might indicate issues beyond the weight that makes them less attractive. Not that this has ever happened with me... *cough*

Bravo for you.
I wasn't aiming in this direction at all.
I was looking for photos of a rubenesque woman.
I found obese women.
page after page of them.

rakafkaven
Jan. 31st, 2002 11:43 am (UTC)
Re:
Yeah, I miss Rubenesque, too. When I talked about how the word changed, I was complaining how people's insecurity and demand that they are no "worse" took a perfectly good, descriptive, and non-judgemental word and made it meaningless. Now, we have Kate Moss and everyone else is Rubenesque. 'Cause if a plain old fat lady calls herself Rubenesque (the only remotely complimentary way of referring to absence of anorexia), no one is allowed to correct her. That's the sort of mentality 'calm was complaining about.
maddening
Jan. 31st, 2002 02:03 pm (UTC)
okay.. then I have no issue with that at all.
I think that main problem with his post was the WAY he went about saying it. It just came off as an attack of all people not fitting into the 'skinny' category.
::shrug::

Another lost word... Zaftig...
I loved that word.
Now it's gone.
frobisher
Jan. 31st, 2002 04:31 pm (UTC)
Not gone. There are just a lot of people lacking any idea of what it means.

Lots of people use words incorrectly. Doesn't make them right. Check out any discussion of the abuse of the word "hacker".

More to the point, this is just further support for my new legislation that just makes anyone I don't like illegal.
( 23 comments — Leave a comment )

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